Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  LP on Tue Jul 06, 2010 9:26 am

scratch That's not a real point of view is it SAINT? I didn't think people actually still acted like that these days scratch
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  Jimmy Saville on Tue Jul 06, 2010 10:49 am

Music is harmless and social......Religion is not!!
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  Guest on Tue Jul 06, 2010 12:37 pm

DarkLord wrote:
ColinS wrote:I think schools should be allowed to teach what they see fit with very few exceptions. Would a child know what he/she has an aptitude for if he/she never tries it. Should the parents be allowed to force their views on a child?

So, let me get this straight, the school should be able to decide what they want to teach their students but a parent should not be allowed to decide what their child is taught...?? scratch scratch

The school syllabus is or should not be picked by each individual school it should be a judgement made jointly between all the Education authorities. Is it right that a Childs future is decided solely by their parents and their hang ups. All children should have the advantage of learning all that is available until they reach an age where they can decide what course THEY want their lives to take.

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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  DarkLord on Tue Jul 06, 2010 1:28 pm

El_Guapo wrote:Yes and no I think is the answer to that one...

The education needed for a particular career choice happens later when the student is older. We're talking about high school kids of college kids.

Before you can think about College surely you should be expected to have a general knowledge in key areas? That's where the duty of the state comes in to make sure the child receives that. Allowing parents to control that initial level of education isn't doing the child any favours.

A child begins to have a say in their education from about the age of 10-11 when they are deciding on Secondary/High School. Although not much, children have an input from that point on do they not? Once there at around age 13-14 (Year Nine) they are given a core set of lessons & can then make a choice of subjects (Around 3 I think). At this point they are having a direct say in their education.

Yes, before you can think of college you need to have knowledge in Key areas. The key areas should be constants. Things which are involved in just about everything. In this country those things, in my opinion, are (Or should be): Science, Maths, English (Reading & writing) Basic knowledge of second Language, Social skills & Team work.

Those six "key" areas go across everything & are the minimum requiement (Except the 2nd language) for most further education courses & just about every job. Knowing those by age 13 gives a child a much better chance of being successful in ANYTHING they wish to do. Replacing one of those with music or religious studies doesn't strengthen the chances for success unless the child wants to go down that road.

(Addition)
As that is the case, unless it's against the wishes of the child, I believe a parent has every right to have a say in what their child does & does not learn outside of that bracket. It won't do the child any favours, but it won't hamper them either......
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  DarkLord on Tue Jul 06, 2010 1:36 pm

ColinS wrote:The school syllabus is or should not be picked by each individual school it should be a judgement made jointly between all the Education authorities. Is it right that a Childs future is decided solely by their parents and their hang ups. All children should have the advantage of learning all that is available until they reach an age where they can decide what course THEY want their lives to take.

I don't see the bonus in a child being held to ransom by the hang ups of education authorities.

They may be authorities on education, but the parent is the authority of the child. If Education standards are slipping it's the responsibility of the education authority. That child is the responsibility of the parent. Lock, Stock & Barrel.......

And anyway, at 13 the child makes up their own mind on education & music does not make up the "Core" lessons....... Why's it so important now?
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  El Guapo on Tue Jul 06, 2010 2:30 pm

[/quote]A child begins to have a say in their education from about the age of 10-11 when they are deciding on Secondary/High School. Although not much, children have an input from that point on do they not? Once there at around age 13-14 (Year Nine) they are given a core set of lessons & can then make a choice of subjects (Around 3 I think). At this point they are having a direct say in their education.

Yes, before you can think of college you need to have knowledge in Key areas. The key areas should be constants. Things which are involved in just about everything. In this country those things, in my opinion, are (Or should be): Science, Maths, English (Reading & writing) Basic knowledge of second Language, Social skills & Team work.

Those six "key" areas go across everything & are the minimum requiement (Except the 2nd language) for most further education courses & just about every job. Knowing those by age 13 gives a child a much better chance of being successful in ANYTHING they wish to do. Replacing one of those with music or religious studies doesn't strengthen the chances for success unless the child wants to go down that road.

(Addition)
As that is the case, unless it's against the wishes of the child, I believe a parent has every right to have a say in what their child does & does not learn outside of that bracket. It won't do the child any favours, but it won't hamper them either......
[/quote]


What real decisions does a 10-11 year old make? I think it depends of the family behind him so it's hard to make that kind of generalisation. Some children will have more input into the direction they take than others depending on how demanding or liberal their parents are.

I'm glad you listed what you think the key areas should be because you're making my point for me. That is your opinion...but the opinions of others may be entirely different. In order to maintain those constants you mention you therefore need a fixed curriculum that you know every child has the potential to learn.

I agree Music isnt really one of the more important subjects to learn to succeed in life but my point is that if one parent can single out Music as not that important what right do we have to refuse another parent to decide, say Science, is also not important? There has to be a fixed level for everyone or nothing is protected.

In the best interests of the child then you have to ensure the curriculum comes before any religious wish of the parents. Religion should not supersede law in any circumstance.

Once the statutory schooling years are over everything opens up. The child can pursue any subject he likes.

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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  DarkLord on Tue Jul 06, 2010 2:49 pm

El_Guapo wrote:What real decisions does a 10-11 year old make? I think it depends of the family behind him so it's hard to make that kind of generalisation. Some children will have more input into the direction they take than others depending on how demanding or liberal their parents are.

I'm glad you listed what you think the key areas should be because you're making my point for me. That is your opinion...but the opinions of others may be entirely different. In order to maintain those constants you mention you therefore need a fixed curriculum that you know every child has the potential to learn.

I agree Music isnt really one of the more important subjects to learn to succeed in life but my point is that if one parent can single out Music as not that important what right do we have to refuse another parent to decide, say Science, is also not important? There has to be a fixed level for everyone or nothing is protected.

In the best interests of the child then you have to ensure the curriculum comes before any religious wish of the parents. Religion should not supersede law in any circumstance.

Once the statutory schooling years are over everything opens up. The child can pursue any subject he likes.

A ten year old makes only decisions they are presented with, but they can make one all the same. A parent will present them with a number of schools to chose from. That number may be 2 or it may be 10, but the child makes a decision. Even if it is 1 the child makes the decision to go along with that or rebel against it, hence some children give no problems & others do.

There is a fixed curriculum. English, Maths, Science. EVERY child has those three things. They recieve social skills from being with other children & are given team activities to help team building. These are the basics of what will get you just about anywhere. These are the foundations on which to build & it is for this reason that parents can't take these away as they are then weakening their child's chances of success which is harming the child. This can be proven by looking at college requirements & Job requirements. You need Maths, science & English to sweep the streets these day.
Music won't make a significant difference either way and in any case wouldn't play a large role in the child's education until at least 11, unless the parents wished otherwise.

As this is the case let it be up to them. For religious or any other reason, unless that child want's to do the lesson, I still totally agree that the parent should have the final word on it as long as it's not one of those 3 core subjects, it doesn't impact on thier social skills & doesn't impact on teamwork skills. The rest are nowhere near as crucial to life as an adult.

It is an opinion. But It's one the majority would surely agree with.....
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  El Guapo on Tue Jul 06, 2010 2:59 pm

You're not getting my point. Let me put it another way.

Music is currently part of the compulsory national curriculum. It's not an "optional" subject for parents nor for children.

By allowing Muslim parents to withdraw their children from Music on religious grounds then sets a case precedent.

Once a precedent has been set in common law courts are then bound by it unless an amended statute of the original Act of Parliament that the case law contradicts is passed.

This then gives every parent of every religion a common law right to withdraw their child from any subject on any religious grounds.

Do you really think this is a wise course to pursue? When I say religion should not supersede law it is because once it does our entire legal system is prone to collapse. Law must at all time be the highest authority in the land.

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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  DarkLord on Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:15 am

Muslim or not, religious reason or not, a parent has the right to take their child out of a lesson or out of school all together for any reason. A parent has the right to home school their child & tailor their curriculum as they see fit. The "National Curriculum" only applies to primary and secondary state schools. It does not apply to independent schools & does not apply to homeschooling, therefore making it only compulsory for the school to aim to follow. Not the parent.

By allowing Muslim parents to withdraw their children from Music on religious grounds then sets a case precedent.
No, it really doesn't. The parent really didn't even have to give a reason whether or not the grounds for the decision are religious, so the reasoning behind it is kinda irrelevant. As I've said, current law states that any parent can withdraw their child from school altogether, meaning withdrawing them from every subject within the national curriculum & withdrawing them from the national curriculum itself. That parent can then school the child in the way they see fit, which does not have to follow the curriculum of the school at all. Every parent of every religion, faith creed & colour can withdraw their child from EVERY subject on ANY grounds, even if they "Just feel like it".

Religion shouldn't supersede law & in this case it doesn't. In the eyes of the law it is up to the parent to decide how their child will be schooled, whether that parent makes that decision on religious grounds or not doesn't factor into it. the parent is staying well within the law. Unless you think it would be a better idea to take the rights of a parent to raise their child how they see fit away from them? I sure don't think that would be a good course to pursue.

My point is simple. Allow the parent to parent their child.
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  El Guapo on Wed Jul 07, 2010 3:21 am

Home schooling is a different matter altogether. We're not talking about parents right to withdraw their child from the statutory national curriculum entirely.

What we're discussing is whether a parent can lawfully specifically select which subjcts their child learns if their child is in a State school.

The bottom line is, by law, they can't. If a parent chooses to enter their child into the state curriculum they must follow it entirely or not at all. There are no optional subjects because the original Act of Parliament does not provide for certain subjects to be optional.

What is happening now is a contradiction to the original Act of Parliament and is precisely how precedent is set in our judicial system.


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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  DarkLord on Wed Jul 07, 2010 3:58 am

The parent isn't selecting which subjects their child studies, they are selecting which one their child does not take part in. As I've said, I myself was easily taken out of 1 lesson in school without having to give a reason to the school. We sat & decided which lesson would take its place.

You can't give schools full responsibility over a childs education & the wishes of the school & curriculum cannot be allowed to override the wishes of the parents or indeed the child. A school doesn't work if it is as inflexible as you suggest. The curriculum wouldn't work if it's as rigid as that either.

The Original act of Parliment was made in the 1800's.... Schooling has changed somewhat since then, but if we concentrate on the latest one (Education act 2005) there is nothing to say that a parent cannot withdraw their child from a lesson. The curriculum is there for the school to follow, to make sure all state run schools are teaching the same thing. What right do they have to make a parent follow it? And if the school really does know better would it not make more sense to allow the child to drop one subject & replace it with another whilst remaining in the school rather than have the parent remove them from the school due to inflexibility of the school?

What is happening now is a contradiction to the original Act of Parliament and is precisely how precedent is set in our judicial system.
No, the Education act & curriculum is not there to monitor parents, it's there to monitor & ensure the minimum standards of state run schools & educators. There is no contradiction. The wishes of a child's parent supersedes those of the school. That's how it's always been, and unless the schools are prepared to take full responsibility of the child, that's the way it should stay.
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  El Guapo on Wed Jul 07, 2010 4:44 am

The Education Act (2005) is irrelevent in this discussion. There is nothing in that Act to prohibit a parent withdrawing their child from a particular lesson because that is not what that Act concerns itself with. The Education Act (2005) was passed as a measure in order to simplify the process of school improvement, strengthening the accountability framework for schools, in particular by amending the approach used by Ofsted when inspecting schools in England. This Act repealed the provisions of the School Inspections Act 1996.

The Act we should be looking at to decide the lawfulness of withdrawing a child from a particular subject is the Education Reform Act (1988) and the Education Act (2002). Notwithstanding their respective names, these Acts do not apply to independent schools (which may set their own curriculum) but it ensures that state schools of all Local Education Authorities have a common curriculum that all pupils are required to follow.

Up until the age of 14 Music is listed in the Education Act (2002) as a core statutory compulsory subject. It's all there in black and white and has never been repealed by later Acts of Parliament.

Accordingly, any attempt to withdraw a child from Music lessons is a breach of the Education Act (2002).

Ofsted owe a duty of care to the child, not the parent, to investigate if they become aware that any pupil's access to the curriculum is being unlawfully restricted. However, an Ofsted spokesman has admitted that often a blind eye is turned but this does not in any way detract or negate statutory obligation.

Now, if the school really wanted to make a fuss, the matter would then pass to the courts to decide. If the courts hold that a parent may restrict their child's access to the core statutory subjects as listed in the Education Act (2002) on religious grounds then that decision becomes a precedent that all future courts must follow unless that precedent is overturned by the court of appeal.

If such a precedent is set it completely undermines the intention of the Education Act (2002) to provide a national standard of education as any parent, of any relgion, would have the right by common law to withdraw their child from any of the core statutory compulsory subjects which can only ever be a very slippery slope.



(edited typo "non-compulsory" to read "compulsory")


Last edited by El_Guapo on Wed Jul 07, 2010 5:18 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  DarkLord on Wed Jul 07, 2010 5:08 am

Laughing Laughing

non compulsory subject.

Compulsory Definition
1. required; mandatory; obligatory: compulsory education.
2. using compulsion; compelling; constraining: compulsory

So, by Non Compulsory we mean that it's not required? Not mandatory or in simpler terms, you don't HAVE to do it. A breach of the Education act would be the state school refusing to allow the child to do Music lessons & withdrawing that option. The Act isn't geared towards the parent so the parent cannot breach the act. If the school insists that the child must take music lessons then the parent can legally withdraw the child from the lesson by withdrawing them from the school & in turn from the national curriculum entirely.
By allowing a parent to withdraw the child from a lesson it's a smarter move by the school & education board as it means the child at least stays in school rather than being withdrawn for the sake of 1 NON compulsory subject.

If such a precedent is set it completely undermines the intention of the Education Act (2002) to provide a national standard of education as any parent, of any religion, would have the right by common law to withdraw their child from any of the core statutory non compulsory subjects which can only ever be a very slippery slope.

Parents have that right already. Take your child out of the school & the above act becomes irrelevant. The very fact that you can legally remove your child from a state school without reason undermines the act. The very fact that this act ONLY applies to state schools undermines the act.
The slippery slope for state schools would be not allowing parents this kind of flexibility. Bottom line is, whatever the reason, the parent has the final say in all aspects of their child’s upbringing until that parent is legally striped of such responsibility. If that happens then the state (Social services) or adoptive parents / legal guardians, have legal responsibility for that child & they have the final say in the child’s education This includes their schooling & by attempting to legally take those rights away from Parents / Legal guardians you'll end up undermining them....... And that slope is full of Ice & oil.....
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  El Guapo on Wed Jul 07, 2010 5:22 am

DarkLord wrote:Laughing Laughing

non compulsory subject.

Compulsory Definition
1. required; mandatory; obligatory: compulsory education.
2. using compulsion; compelling; constraining: compulsory

So, by Non Compulsory we mean that it's not required? Not mandatory or in simpler terms, you don't HAVE to do it. A breach of the Education act would be the state school refusing to allow the child to do Music lessons & withdrawing that option. The Act isn't geared towards the parent so the parent cannot breach the act. If the school insists that the child must take music lessons then the parent can legally withdraw the child from the lesson by withdrawing them from the school & in turn from the national curriculum entirely.
By allowing a parent to withdraw the child from a lesson it's a smarter move by the school & education board as it means the child at least stays in school rather than being withdrawn for the sake of 1 NON compulsory subject.

If such a precedent is set it completely undermines the intention of the Education Act (2002) to provide a national standard of education as any parent, of any religion, would have the right by common law to withdraw their child from any of the core statutory non compulsory subjects which can only ever be a very slippery slope.

Parents have that right already. Take your child out of the school & the above act becomes irrelevant. The very fact that you can legally remove your child from a state school without reason undermines the act. The very fact that this act ONLY applies to state schools undermines the act.
The slippery slope for state schools would be not allowing parents this kind of flexibility. Bottom line is, whatever the reason, the parent has the final say in all aspects of their child’s upbringing until that parent is legally striped of such responsibility. If that happens then the state (Social services) or adoptive parents / legal guardians, have legal responsibility for that child & they have the final say in the child’s education This includes their schooling & by attempting to legally take those rights away from Parents / Legal guardians you'll end up undermining them....... And that slope is full of Ice & oil.....



For the first paragraph of your post please see my amendment to my previous post. Very Happy

In response to your second paragraph removing your child from a state school entirely is not the same as keeping your child IN a state school but on the condition you choose which subjects they learn. In fact, I don't think it's even close to being the same thing. As it is not the same thing of course the rules are different because they relate to something else....lol

Gotta dash...;-)

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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  SAINT on Wed Jul 07, 2010 6:56 am

LP wrote: scratch That's not a real point of view is it SAINT? I didn't think people actually still acted like that these days scratch

So what would you call it then? it's my point of view so tough!!

You have your views and I have mine.

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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  SAINT on Wed Jul 07, 2010 7:04 am

DarkLord wrote:
SAINT wrote:Yeah, exactly my thoughts, i'm still waiting for ONE single MUSLIM to CONDEMN 9/11 & 7/7

Why is it that MUSLIMS do not protest in LONDON regarding the TERRORISTS, they seem to want to burn U.S. and othr flags!!

Explanation anyone?

My apologies. I didn't realise you'd met Every single Muslim on the planet Rolling Eyes Many Muslims have condemned 9/11 & 7/7. Maybe you just didn't read those .......
Why should they protest? I've never protested about Terrorists in London & I was born & raised there. I wonder if the Irish protested in London about Terrorist during the 80's & 90's?? scratch Can't reacalll......

Good thing I know little about you. I might start to think that everyone who shares one of your beliefs share all of them......... But that'd be fair to do right?

TBQH, I wouldn't like to, if I did i'd probably be in a shraia court charged with something MUSLIMS don't like or agree with!

My beliefs are my business, my opinions are what I believe so don't sit there telling me and the rest of the world who LOATHE ISLAM that it's a peace loving great RELIGION, many country's worldwide have caught on to the misery in which ISLAM bring to every country they settle in.

If MUSLIMS do NOT like opinions about them from the indigenous people then choose a port, plenty to choose from!!

If I lived in a country which LOATHED who I was then I would leave, simple!!!

ISLAM the TERRORIST CULT is NOT welcome in my country and shouldn't have to put up with their SHIT!!!! SIMPLE!!!

If you don't like my opinions TOUGH SHIT!!!!

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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  El Guapo on Wed Jul 07, 2010 7:13 am

Everybody take a deep breath and count to ten....lol

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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  DarkLord on Wed Jul 07, 2010 8:26 am

SAINT wrote:TBQH, I wouldn't like to, if I did i'd probably be in a shraia court charged with something MUSLIMS don't like or agree with!

My beliefs are my business, my opinions are what I believe so don't sit there telling me and the rest of the world who LOATHE ISLAM that it's a peace loving great RELIGION, many country's worldwide have caught on to the misery in which ISLAM bring to every country they settle in.

If MUSLIMS do NOT like opinions about them from the indigenous people then choose a port, plenty to choose from!!

If I lived in a country which LOATHED who I was then I would leave, simple!!!

ISLAM the TERRORIST CULT is NOT welcome in my country and shouldn't have to put up with their SHIT!!!! SIMPLE!!!

If you don't like my opinions TOUGH SHIT!!!!

Your beliefs are your business, but when you post them on a public forum for debate they become the business of those you are debating with also.

Please point out where I said that Islam was a
peace loving great RELIGION
Islam as a religion is no more or less peace loving & great than christianity, Judaism or any other religion or faith.
Why should a person who was born & bred here but has decided to be Muslim choose a port & leave THEIR country because they don't agree with your views? Indigenous people to these shores can be Muslim. There isn't a requirement which states that you have to be born in a muslim state or even to Muslim parents to be Muslim.

Islam is no more a terrorist cult than Christianity & I'm afraid you don't have a say in who is & isn't allowed in OUR country.

Your opinions are yours, but your opinions are also a long way from the facts.......
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muslim withdrawl

Post  chelseaz on Fri Jul 09, 2010 3:42 am

i think it is important children paticipate in all subjects including sport.in school i hated physics and chemistry loved dance drama and art.altough i have persused the later i have been amazed in life how many times i have had to use knowlege learned in subjects i didn't like.music classes these days are very different from the choice of ...choose violin or trumpet.the majority of the music business today incorporates the use of computers then you have the marketing,design,development, p.r. the list is endless.even if these children do not want to do anything directly with music in the future, the other aspects of what they learn in these classes could well prove important and very relevant to what they choose to do in the future.no opting out as far as i'm concern.
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  DarkLord on Fri Jul 09, 2010 3:54 am

......the majority of the music business today incorporates the use of computers then you have the marketing,design,development, p.r. the list is endless....

Problem is that none of the above comes into music lessons until after year 9. Before that it's "Here's a recorder, You take the Triangle & you have the bongos....."
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RE BONGOS

Post  chelseaz on Fri Jul 09, 2010 4:35 am

nothing wrong with a good bang on the bongos or a tinkle on the triangle...teaches co ordination and co operation with others...whats so wrong with that?
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  DarkLord on Fri Jul 09, 2010 5:46 am

Nothing, except you can learn co-ordination & Co-operation in PE, Science, Maths, English, Drama, Design & technology, Home Economics..... Just about every subject teaches one if not both of those......

The only thing you can learn in early Music lessons which you won't get from any other lesson is how to play a particular instrument & even then there's a limit to how much they can teach you before you need to take private lessons.......

Hence I don't see what makes it an "important" subject unless a career music is the plan.
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  El Guapo on Fri Jul 09, 2010 6:00 am

DarkLord wrote:Nothing, except you can learn co-ordination & Co-operation in PE, Science, Maths, English, Drama, Design & technology, Home Economics..... Just about every subject teaches one if not both of those......

The only thing you can learn in early Music lessons which you won't get from any other lesson is how to play a particular instrument & even then there's a limit to how much they can teach you before you need to take private lessons.......

Hence I don't see what makes it an "important" subject unless a career music is the plan.


Gotta disagree here...

What can we learn from Music lessons? We learn how to read music, how music is composed, we learn about the classics; Mozart, Beethoven, and Bach; we learn about the history of music and how it has developed and shaped societies, and we learn how to identify and pick out different instruments when we hear them.

Through music, people come together and produce something special, whether creating community, fostering the creative process, or having fun and experiencing joy. Music has an effect on everybody, even spiritually — an idea that can be traced back to Plato and Aristotle.

Think about a time when you sang along with a song playing on the radio. Why did you do that? What moved you? Music is a part of human nature. We must allow children to embrace and explore music in school. Music is a meaningful language of emotion, and the fact that music is meaningful is probably the reason that Howard Gardner classified music as its own intelligence.

We live in a world with constantly shifting realities, but in this postmodern era, the effects and relevance of music have remained constant. Philosophical theories may change, but the ends haven’t. So why do we have music in schools? To teach our children and youth how to live, work and play in the world. Music can make a significant contribution in each of those things. And music, in some form, will always be a part of our culture. It is through music that we will continue to identify ourselves.

Saying Music isn't important unless you intend to pursue a career in the industry is like saying English Literature is not important unless you intend to be an author, or History is not important unless you intend to become an Historian.

The thing with children and schools is that giving children access to a wide range of subjects helps the child to realise their potential in any given area. How does a musician know he can write music if he is never even given the chance?


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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  DarkLord on Fri Jul 09, 2010 6:37 am

Yeah, but again, all of that history stuff, composing & things like that, don't come into it until after year 9 when music is no longer compulsory, and from each school year they will only take upto 35 pupils (Dependant on year size) into music lessons for year 9 upwards.

Yes, there's the creative process but that can be gained from Art, Design tech, Home Ec, drama, dance..... It's not unique to music.
As for the history of music, you learn about that in History lessons, with much more detail as well.

Saying Music isn't important unless you intend to pursue a career in the industry is like saying English Literature is not important unless you intend to be an author, or History is not important unless you intend to become an Historian.
Not quite, English lit is important as it teaches you to read & understand the English Language, something which is kind of important if you live in England or any English speaking country. History is important because it's important to know where we came from, again, very useful in life as if one wishes to know thyself one must know where thee has come from.

Music doesn't have that. You dance to a tune because you like it. You sing along to the radio & in the shower because you enjoy it & if that's the case & you wanna take music, as I said earlier, you shouldn't be stopped from doing that. But, schools stop children doing that from age 13-14 for no more reason than it's on a first come first served basis. If music was that important it would be mandatory throughout the entire scholastic life, like English is, like Maths is, Like science is. Music lessons don't teach you anything unique which can be broadly used in all walks of life & all the good stuff, the useful stuff, like the history of music, history of musicians, even composing a song, doesn't come into it until much later, funnily enough when it is no longer a compulsory subject........

As this is the case it clearly just does not hold the importance of other subjects.
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Re: Why are Muslim parents withdrawing their kids from music lessons?

Post  El Guapo on Fri Jul 09, 2010 6:58 am

English Language teaches you how to read and write. English Literature teaches you to appreciate the written word. Tww entirely different things. Likewise a music lesson teaches you to appreciate the aural note rather than just how to bang a drum.

You're never going to learn about the history of music in a history lesson. History lessons teach you about the world wars, the monarchy, the Romans etc. Musical history is too specific to be taught as part of the general history syllabus.

You still seem to be under the impression Music is not a compulsory subject. It is part of the compulsory National Curriculum up until the age of 16. After that NO subject is mandatory as a student can pick any A-Levels he or she wants.

The question here is whether a parent should be able to withdraw a child from Music on religious grounds not whether Music is as important a subject as others. Saying it is okay for a parent to totally ignore the statutory requirement for their child to attend music lessons just because "It's not as important as the other subjects" is a little insulting to the hundreds of thousands of people all over the world that have dedicated their entire lives to the study of it.

No parent of any religion should have the right to withdraw their child from any lesson on religious grounds. Religion has no place in Law.



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